Unrehearsed Futures (Season 3) #2 From Our Correspondents: A Conversation Between Ukrainian and Russian Theatre Artists

We had a very unique session at our second Unrehearsed Futures conversation of Season 3, where we invited Ukrainian and Russian theatre artists to share their thoughts about the ongoing war in Ukraine, which Russia invaded on 24 February, 2022.

A gut wrenching conversation, several artists from both countries shared their lived experiences, their fears, their anguish, and their hopes, while others in the room held the space.

‘Don’t know when we will see each other again’

Maria Vanieieva, an Ukrainian actress at the Pushkin Theatre in Kharkiv, had to flee the city with her little child and drive all the way to Berlin (from where she joined for the conversation). Maria, who is separated from her husband as he could not leave Ukraine, shared that she never thought something like what happened with her was possible in these times. ““This is so scary because we don’t know when we will see each other again. This is really the destruction and killing of people,” she asserted. “Somebody comes and shoots you, your family, your relatives, destroys your house, your city, your country. And what surprised me the most is the ability of people to say to all of the world that what is happening in Ukraine is not true. That this nightmare is a fantasy of somebody, of these ‘people’ who are ‘damaged’. This lie is what angers me the most.”

When the war began, Maria, a 34-year-old who also taught at the Kotlyarevsky Drama University, had to quit everything she had been building. For six days, she could hear bombs close to her house. Another house located two minutes away from hers had no windows anymore. Every time Maria heard the sound of a bomb blast, she and her family would rush to their basement. Shad to leave her mother back in Kharkiv because she couldn’t find the strength in her to start a new life elsewhere. “So, she said, ‘I will be here till the end’,” Maria continues.

What has been harder for Maria is knowing friends and family who don’t believe her when she recounts her experience, especially many of the Russian folks. “I have a sister from Tyumen in Russia who wrote to me that Russia is trying to save Ukraine from the Nazis. Where are people finding information that Ukrainians beat Russians? I have been speaking Russian all my life. Half of Ukraine speaks Russian,” she says. “We were happy in our country. I don’t know why somebody decided to come and save me. It’s such a crazy idea.”

‘My country is sick’

While Ukrainians expressed their anguish, Russian artists shared the horror they felt at witnessing the war. Though the Russian government propaganda is a strong influence on Russians’ lives, there is a section of the population that doesn’t believe it and is aware of what actually is happening in Ukraine. Mikhail (name changed), a theatre-maker from St. Petersburg is overwhelmed by the horror unfolding in their neighbouring country. “What can I do and what can thousands of other Russian people do? We have no right to hope that we will be forgiven. But we must ask for forgiveness,” he says. “My country is sick. It’s been sick for a long time. This is the terminal stage of the disease.”

Mikhail also shared a letter from a choreographer friend: “I tried to start this letter several times. But I don’t know how to use words in a situation like this. What’s happening right now is a disaster. I want to beg for forgiveness, but I understand I have no rights to be forgiven. The only thing I can do is create art. Nowadays, I hope that it can be a place that puts humanity and peace in the centre, not politics, not destruction. At least I must do what I can to make theatre that place. I know this is not enough to change something, but I won’t forgive myself if I do nothing.”

What the news is missing

It’s interesting how the human brain functions under the stress of traumatic events, observed Sandro Garibashvili, a Ukrainian performer and maker who fled Kharkiv a few weeks ago with his wife Maria Koreneva and child. “We may have been through a lot,” he says, “but psychologically, I think there’s a huge block on all the experience. Because if we were to open it, we would just be completely overwhelmed and probably squashed, trying to process everything.”

Sandro and Maria feel like they are nowhere. Ever since they left Kharkiv, their mind has been caught in different places – helping their other friends and family get out of Kharkiv, figuring out logistics, finding out information of organisations that are carrying people on buses to the border, or figuring out how their pregnant friend will give birth.

With so many friends and family members spread across, their focus ends up getting fragmented. “Last night,” shares Maria, “I had this strange experience wherein I woke up at night and I knew there was no bombing happening, but I could hear that bombing taking place somewhere, as though on a body level. And then I learned later that exactly at that time, our city was bombed again heavily.”

Both Sandro and Maria shared experiences of living in school buildings and restaurant basements and for a large part, relying on the kindness of strangers. While the constant worrying and travelling is taking a toll on their health, they do find some things missing from news coverage, judging from the way their friends from other countries have been reacting to the war. “What the news is missing is the fact that we’re still hoping to come back,” Maria says. “The news is portraying everything as though it is a final catastrophe after which there will be nothing. We have friends in the States who call us and tell us that nuclear bombs will be dropped on us and that we must get out. From our side, there is a lot of reluctance to believe in it. It feels so strange that everybody wants us to get out.”

What is also missing from the news, says Maria, is that with cities being bombed, and cultural institutions and buildings crumbling, a huge part of civilization in Ukraine is being erased. As artists, Maria’s main concern isn’t making art, but rather making sure her family survives. “Can we even allow ourselves to create anything, or do we just have to fight? We are taking this to a very primitive level. I have to go and heal, I can’t do art. I’m not in a peaceful place to do art. That’s what it’s so scary.”

‘There is no democracy’

Russian theatre-maker Irina (name changed) believes that while there is a lot of hatred for Russians from outside the country, what is not well-known that “there is a war going on between people inside [Russia]”. “Families are falling apart because of different political views,” she shares, “Couples are getting divorced. Friends are turning into enemies. There is no democracy in Russia. What is being said on our televisions is a total lie. They are manipulating us into thinking that enemies are all around and war is needed to save Russia.”

Irina is one of the few who has been actively protesting the ongoing war in Ukraine. While there is a call from the West for Russians to act against their government, it is crucial to note that it is quite dangerous for citizens to do so. Since the war broke out, Irina has been part of four demonstrations, and during one of those, she was detained for 24 hours and let go later with a fine of 15,000 rubles.

Many from the older generations in Ukraine and Russia live in the nostalgia of the Soviet Union. Maria’s 75-year-old mother, for example, refused to believe that Russia would bomb them. “On the second day of war, when the bombs began to fall, she said, ‘Don’t worry, Putin promised to bomb only military targets. Nothing will happen.’ On the day number three, she said ‘Okay, if you want to go in the countryside for two days, let’s do so because Russia said it’s going to last for five days only.’” Eventually, as the bombing continued, her mother’s resolve crumbled, and her belief system shattered. “She saw that she had believed in a lie all along. She also said that the people in Russia were not going to believe until the bombs dropped on their heads, like we have now,” elaborates Maria.

As the conversation came to a close, both Ukrainian and Russian artists agreed that the war happening in Ukraine isn’t just on its citizens. As Garibashvili said, it is a war on people. “It’s bigger than just Russia versus Ukraine. It’s a war on humanity as a whole. And the war is a call to action for anybody who stands for any kind of human values.”

(Please note: This video contains edited excerpts from the conversation.)